Well, we've got more now on our
top
story. Uh, the government has promised
to harm violence against women and girls
uh within the decade, and they're trying
to change attitudes among boys and young
men at the beginning of their strategy,
the center of their strategy. Well,
joining us now is Lisa Squire, uh, whose
daughter Libby was raped and murdered.
She was aged 21 and that was in 2019.
Um, thank you so much for being on the
program. I I remember Libby very very
clearly I should say is the first thing
I want to say. Um and what happened to
her was unbearable. Um you know she was
a student at Woll University. She was
targeted after a night out. I remember
very clearly you know that kind of
weight.
>>
It must have been I can't imagine what
it must have been like for you.
>>
Yes. 48 days of not knowing where she
was um was absolutely horrendous.
>>
Um and thank you for coming on and
talking about it a little bit as well.
I'm sure it is difficult for you even
though you also I'm sure want to talk
about Libby.
>>
Yes.
>>
As well. Um firstly um what do you make
about the strategy against violence
against women and girls? How how
important do you think it is?
>>
I think it's it's really taking some
positive steps. I mean obviously there's
a lot to do there's and and I've been
saying this for the last you know five
or six years. We've got loads to do but
I think the government are moving in the
right direction because I mean there's
been lots of talk and not very much
action. So, I'm I'm really I'm really
encouraged by this morning's
announcements.
>>
Is there anything in particular that
you're kind of pleased about?
>>
Yes, I I like the whole um I like the
element of of teaching in schools, of
educating in schools. I mean, it
shouldn't be down to school teachers,
you know, it it should be starting from
the home when the children are, you
know, small enough to understand, but
it's obviously not happening. So, school
is the next place. And actually in
reality, school teachers spend more time
with the children than than we do or
with young people than their parents do
in reality. Um so yeah, I'm really
encouraged about that. But I think
whether the funding will be enough, I
think they'll need there probably will
need to be an uplift in funding. But but
it's the idea is there and the promise
is there. The man who killed Libby was a
stranger to her. Yes.
>>
But he committed a lot of offenses
before. This is what really sort of
strikes me about this, you know, spying
on women through windows, masturbating
in the street, breaking into people's
homes to steal intimate items. Do you
think we need to take these red flags a
lot more seriously?
>>
Absolutely. And that's been my my
biggest part of the thing I the work
I've been doing is I go into schools, I
go into police forces. I mean, I I'll go
anywhere that anybody will have me and I
talk about non-cont sexual offenses. It
is not normal behavior for a man to be
doing the things that you've described.
They are red flag offenses. They are
gateway offenses. And and I think if we
can focus a bit more on those, then we
it seems logical to me that if we can
stop some of those, we'll stop some
rapes and andor murders.
>>
And and is it something that needs to
start or or this is more something
that's sensibly paired with all of this
with young boys in the classroom as as
the government's been talking about
today?
>>
I think it needs to be paired together.
Um, but I also think we need to be
talking to our young women and young
girls and saying or and and women and
girls and saying to them, if you are a
victim of a non-cont offense, you
absolutely have to report it because,
you know, historically and even I think
still today, women are conditioned to
accept it. We just think, oh, it's just
that strange man, you know, but it's not
okay. And if the police don't know
anything about it, they can't do
anything about it. So I think it's about
bringing it all together, educating our
young people and saying that this
behavior is not normal, this behavior is
not normal. You must, you know, and and
just giving them the information because
I do believe that young people are, you
know, are the are the way forwards.
>>
It's true about not reporting. I mean,
I've been flashed a couple of times and
it didn't even cross my mind to report
it. But I remember, am I right in saying
that Libby happened to Libby?
>>
Yes. So in the November before she died,
she rang me and she said, "Oh, mom, I
was walking home and a man flashed at me
and she was absolutely livid. She was so
angry and I did. I talked her down. I
said, "Do you need me to come and get
you? Do you want to come home?" She
said, "Mom, I'm fine. I'm absolutely
fine. I'm just so angry, but I didn't
tell her to report it because I didn't
know. I didn't know then. I mean, it's
happened to me. It's happened to all of
my girlfriends and I just
>>
I didn't know. I know better now."
>>
We're looking at pictures of Libby.
>>
Oh, bless her.
>>
And there's the two of you as well.
I was you read this incredible victim
impact statement to court that if if
it's okay I just want to read a little
bit of you said you know in any times of
trouble. She wanted me her mom.
>>
She knew I would do anything in my power
to help her and knowing I was not there
when she needed me will haunt me for the
rest of my life. So first of all you
sound like an amazing mom like an
amazing amazing mom to Libby and your
other children as well.
>>
Is there anything you want to share
about Libby? like any memories you have
of her or
>>
she was she was so funny. Um I mean she
didn't even know how funny she was. Um
she was an amazing big sister. She
absolutely idolized her three siblings
and was the best daughter. I mean all of
my kids are wonderful but of course as
I've said to you earlier my other three
children will say of course Libbyy's the
best. Um but yeah her and I were
incredibly close. I mean I'm close with
all my children but Libby and I maybe
it's because my she was my firstborn. We
were incredibly close and um there was
nothing she didn't tell me. There was
nothing, you know, she was Yeah. She was
just incredible. And the loss is it's is
indescribable, you know, but we we've
got to a stage in the family now where
we're talking about how she lived, not
how she died. So, she moves forwards
with us and she's always around us.
>>
Well, I mean, that's an amazing
perspective to have and you know, your
bravery shines through just by being
here today, but but also by that answer.
I wanted to ask just quickly about a
different topic if I could um which is
the the early release scheme that's
taking place at the moment. Um obviously
um
>>
Libbyy's uh killer is is uh doesn't fall
under this um uh being in jail for
murder and rape, but
>>
but it does happen with people of of
some sexual offenses. Um clearly the
government inherited an extraordinary
backlog and a prison system under huge
pressure. But h how does it make you
feel when you do see some of these early
releases that take place? I just I it it
makes me angry and it makes me really
sad for the family for the victim and
the victim's families. Um I have a a
massive issue with with with um the
justice system myself. You know, I think
we need to have a complete reform of it.
Um there are people in prisons that
don't need to be in prisons. They can be
punished in other ways, but people who,
you know, commit sexual offenses, who,
you know, who hurt people that didn't
ought to be on the streets. So releasing
somebody when they've had a sentence,
and the sentences aren't long enough. I
mean, in our case, he got life with a
minimum of 27 years. He was 24 when he
killed Libby. He'll be in his early 50s
when he gets out. That's not a sentence.
The life sentence is what myself and my
husband and then my children have and
then their children, you know, we have
the life sentence. So, I think there
needs to be a whole new look at at um at
sentencing. I mean, I would have
everybody who takes a life in prison for
the rest of theirs. And if you commit an
offense where you hurt somebody or you
know a sexual offense or you or anything
like that, you need to be in prison for
a very long time. Not a 20 year
sentence, but you'll only serve 10 or
you may only serve eight now. You know,
it's it's not okay.
>>
Clearly, there's a lot that the
government is announcing this week,
today, and we've talked about that and
and the way that you you embrace that.
Stepping aside from those specifics,
though, is there a sense we're actually
getting softer? uh maybe because of
unbelievable pressures whether it's the
prison system or or the judiciary but do
you feel like the general direction of
travel is is in the right direction or
not? I I think we are getting softer on
sentencing and I think we need to pull
it right back in and go hard, you know,
because if people think, well, I'm only
if I'm if people are compelled to do
these things and know they're only going
to get 18 months inside, it's no
deterrent, you know, we need a robust
deterrent and that to me is, you know, a
long time in prison and al and alongside
that, you know, treatment services,
help, you know, rehabilitation services,
which I don't think happen in inside
now. Um, it's going to be Libbyy's
birthday soon.
>>
It is. Yeah.
>>
New Year's Day.
>>
New Year's Day. Yes.
>>
How are you going to be marking that?
>>
Um, well, in the year's gone by, we've
gone up to Libbyy's bench up on the hill
and we've had sort of friends and family
join us there. Um, I'm not too sure I
want to do that this year. I found this
year really difficult. It was nearly
seven years and I've I found this year
really difficult. So, I'm kind of
thinking I'm might put a little post out
to her friends and ask them to send me a
message with a memory or a picture of
her just so I can have a bit more of
Libby back in my life. But we'll just
have a Libby day and we'll probably
watch her favorite movie and sadly we'll
have to drink Lambrini because that's
what she liked. Um I'm I'm hoping by 28
she'd have moved over to sort of at
least Prosecco by now. Um yeah and uh and
we'll have to eat Red Velvet Cake
because that was her favorite cake as
well.
>>
What's her favorite movie?
>>
Uh Nightmare Before Christmas.
>>
Oh, fantastic.
>>
Yes, that was her favorite. So, we'll
we'll just go through the list of other
films she liked and and anything that
the the other the other three want to
do, you know, Libby related, we'll do
for the day.
>>
Thank you so much.
>>
Thank you. Thank you for having me.
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