I want to ask you first of all
about
Ukraine because obviously we've had
developments overnight with EU leaders
coming to an agreement to loan Ukraine
90 billion euros but this will come from an
EU loan rather than using frozen Russian
assets. Is that a disappointing
compromise? Well, I've always been in
favor of us first of all making sure
that Putin cannot win the war because
he's marauding across another sovereign
nation whose territorial integrity he
guaranteed in the Budapest Accords all
those years ago when Ukraine surrendered
its nuclear weapons in exchange for that
territorial integrity. Um sec and we
stand absolutely shoulder-to-shoulder
with our Ukrainian allies. Um, I think
it it should be possible for us to be
able to use the frozen assets of the
Russian state um as opposed to of
Russian individuals. I think that's a
really important distinction and we've
been drawing that distinction ourselves
for some time. You don't want
governments marauding all over the place
and and taking other people's assets.
Um, but um this is I think a a good
compromise. It means that um Ukraine is
going to have the money it wants. We've
also taken a slightly different approach
in the UK. You will recall that um
Abramovich owned Chelsea Football Club.
Um he sold it just before he was
sanctioned um and guaranteed that the
money was going to be going to uh to
Ukraine to war-torn, um, areas in Ukraine.
Um that still hasn't happened because
he's been holding out. Um we the prime
minister announced this week that we
intend to make that happen and if
necessary we'll take him to court. But
it would obviously be much easier if
Abramovich said now that the £2.5 billion
pounds worth could go um to war on
Ukraine today.
>>
And on the subject of the frozen Russian
assets in the loan to Ukraine. Belgium
had asked other countries to to share
the the risk of using those assets.
Could the UK have done more to offer
that kind of backing and that
reassurance?
>>
I think we've been there from the very
beginning and we've been trying to help
um Belgium get over the line. I don't
know the precise details of the of the
final conversations that there were
overnight. Um but look, the most
important thing is that Ukraine needs
the financial support to be able to see
off the Russian aggression. Um we the
whole of Europe knows that this is about
our future. Do you remember a couple of
years ago, I think it was Boris Johnson
sitting on a committee in the House of
Commons and saying poo pooing the idea
of war in Europe and saying, "Oh, the
days of tanks rolling across Europe are
long, long past." Well, we've had a
wakeup call, haven't we? Now, I've been
saying since 2014 that actually when we
allowed Putin to invade Crimea and take
it, that that was the first step and
that he would then come for more if we
let him get away with that. So, this is
more than 10 years of aggression that
we've been dealing with on our
doorsteps. We need to be very robust in
our response.
>>
Talking of foreign threats, there were
reports this morning that Chinese
hackers have stolen thousands of secret
files from the foreign office. can
confirm that that's happened.
>>
So, there certainly has been a hack at
the FCDO and we've been aware of that
since um October and just as um you will
have been reporting earlier on this year
on um the cyber hack at JLR and at Mark
and Spencers and, um, earlier last year I
think it was at the British Library. All
of these are really important things for
us to um tackle and be aware of and and
and prevent wherever possible. Some of
the reporting has I think been a bit
more speculation than accurate. So what
can you tell us fact-wise?
>>
Remarkably little is the honest truth. I
mean there is a October. So
quite often the investigation takes
quite a long time to get down to the
facts. We managed to close the hole as
it were very quickly. Um it was a
technical issue in one of our sites I
gather. Um and uh I I I we we're fairly
confident um that there's a low risk of
any individual actually being um
affected by this. I know that some of
the reports have have said potentially
um various things could happen. I think
that that's a bit more speculation than
is helpful. Um so I don't want to scare
about this. I I we are on top of it. Um
and also it's not entirely clear where
this has come from. I know everybody's
speculating about that as well. It's
that that is not entirely clear either.
>>
So it's not clear that it's Chinese
hackers as is being reported.
>>
No, it's not entirely clear to us.
>>
Can you give us an idea of the nature of
the material that has been compromised?
>>
No.
Again, I'm being fairly careful here
because um just as when it happened with
JLR and with Mark and Spencers, I don't
want to um there's some stuff that I
simply don't know, but there's also
stuff that I think it would be a bad
idea to put in the public domain.
>>
Okay, let's move on to the Employment
Rights Act because it came into law
yesterday. It's great finally. It's
really good news. Yes.
>>
Yeah. It's great. And there are elements
that I'm sure lots of people, lots of
workers will be pleased about. um access
to sick pay and paternity leave from day
one, but it is heavily watered down, not
least because that significant measure,
the right to claim unfair dismissal at
day one, has been scrapped. Are you
disappointed that it's a watered down
version?
>>
No. So, so first of all, I think it's
really good that the final version of
the bill is um we we we managed to get
businesses and unions and government to
sit down around the same table and come
forward with a proposal which I think 15
million people in the UK will get new
rights from and will be will be pleased
with that. Um not least because I I've
never believed in this kind of workers
against the bosses kind of um rhetoric.
I've always thought if you want to have
a really strong economy, you want to
have workers who are incentivized and
feel valued in their work. Um, most
really good businesses know that as
well. So, it is good news that from
April next year, people will have uh
paternity leave and uh unpaid parental
leave um from uh from day one. Uh we'll
have we're getting rid of the three-day
waiting moment for um sick pay. Uh we're
putting in in place a better enforcement
measure which is take which is taking
three different organizations and
putting them into one. So, saving money.
And then other things we're going that
are in the bill. So for instance the
ending exploitative zero as contracts. I
want to be very clear ending
exploitative ones because there are ways
in there are versions of this where
where it works for both sides but when
it doesn't work for both sides then it
is exploitation. So some of those other
elements we're going to introduce over
two years. But I think that I think the
one proposal you that was uh that we
obviously started the bill with um which
was that we were going to take the two
years rights down that your rights
didn't really kick on unfair dismissal
didn't uh kick in until two years in.
We've taken that down to 6 months rather
than day one. I think that that is a
good compromise. Businesses and trade
unions sat around the table together.
>>
They did. You say it's good for
businesses, but some businesses might
say we like the idea of happy workers,
but we can't necessarily afford as many
of them. And in fact, the tries are
calling it a job destroying bill.
They're pointing out the fact that
unemployment is rising. It's up to its
highest level in almost 5 years. And
they're saying that it piles extra costs
on small businesses. I mean, they have
got a point, haven't they?
>>
No, I don't think they have. I think
there are two versions of the world, you
know, there is a Tory version of the
world in in which you want to pit one
set of people against another. And there
is another version of the world where
where you get businesses and trade
unions and and government to sit around
the table and develop legislation
together to guarantee that people have
rights in work, which means that they're
more fulfilled. They're more likely to
um engage. And and I think we will have
a thriving economy if we get these
things right. And and you know, it's
been quite a week for us because we've
had um interest rates come down. They're
coming down faster um than in for for
many decades, which is really good news.
That's more money in people's pockets.
Um we've we've also had the growth um
forecasts increased in the last couple
of months since in since since the
budget. Um debt is beginning to fall.
There are so um and wages are rising. So
all of this I think is good news for an
economy that I think we should be very
optimistic about as we write go into
2026.
>>
Before I let you go, I just want to ask
you about the the news the government's
confirmed that local councils in England
that are undergoing reorganization will
be given the option of delaying May's
elections next year. here. The tries are
saying that means you've got little
regard for local people and their
democratic rights. Uh Nigel Farage has
called um Karmama he's accused Karma of
turning the UK into a banana republic.
>>
Look uh for years in the UK large parts
of the UK have had a mixture of local
authorities. You have district
authorities which are in charge of some
of some things like rubbish collection
and so on and and a local and a county
council which is in charge of education
um and social care and things like that.
We are doing the biggest reorganization
of local government um for many decades.
It's really important. It will save
money. It will make local authorities
more effective. We put 78 billion pounds
into local authorities in our local
government finance settlement. And on
the back of that, we're simply saying to
people, look, you're going to have these
new authorities are going to come online
in two years time. Does it make sense
for you up to you to decide does it make
sense for you to hold elections for
people who will only be in post for a
year?
I think most people will go, "Hang on,
that that just doesn't seem to make any
kind of sense. Why don't we just delay
the elections for a year?" I I I I I
just think it's a common sense proposal
and and we will end up with much more
effective local government because of
the local government reorganization. But
when you have transitional moments, um
that's always difficult. I just want to
say one other thing because I got the
Korea deal, our trade a new trade deal,
our fourth trade deal this year over the line.
line. We managed to um uh get the my
Korean counterpart over here on in on
in J on Monday. That is yet
another example of where we're giving
businesses, UK businesses, an
opportunity to shine around the world.
>>
Okay. Um I'm sure businesses would love
to have an interview with you and talk
about some of the stresses on them, but
we don't have time.
>>
I'm happy to do that whenever you want
to have me on. Okay. Well, we will we
will do just that. We'll set it up.
>>
Have a lovely lovely Christmas.
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